RE: Mitose: the man, the myth
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RE: Mitose: the man, the myth - May 14th, 2007, 7:13:25 PM
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Danjo
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quote:
ORIGINAL: GAB
quote:
ORIGINAL: Danjo
GAB Wrote: "The time frame of Kajukenb/po is different now than it was in the 60's when I first came in contact with that group."
What was the story when you were told it back in the 60's ?
Hi,
Danjo,
The time frame I was aware of was early 60's, before that it was considered Shotokan, we did the same drills and basics I believe and then there was the Kung Fu. The term that was used a lot was Hawaii street fighting.
But you know, it is not fair to say that is the way it really was, it is just what was mentioned, that I remember. I mentioned it to John Bishop and he said something about it being copyrighted in 1960 I believe.
Gary
I'm still not sure what you're saying here. Are you saying that before 1960 Kajukenbo was called Shotokan according to what you heard back then? If so, that is way wrong information. Even the earliest photos of the Emperado's schools had Kenpo Karate on the wall banners. Shotokan was something totally different. There may well have been those like the Bunda's that worked out with the Shotokan guys in California back in the day, but it was never considered the same thing by either camp.
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RE: Mitose: the man, the myth - May 14th, 2007, 7:32:02 PM
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GAB
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The time frame was when Leonings was called "North American Karate and Kung Fu" I am thinking?
Board ate my post again. Hmmmm
Gary
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RE: Mitose: the man, the myth - May 15th, 2007, 11:17:04 AM
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Danjo
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quote:
ORIGINAL: GAB
The time frame was when Leonings was called "North American Karate and Kung Fu" I am thinking?
Board ate my post again. Hmmmm
Gary
That was in the late 1960's and early 1970's I think. Long after he came to the Mainland. So you're saying that he called what he did Shotokan at that late date?
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RE: Mitose: the man, the myth - May 15th, 2007, 11:40:23 AM
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Danjo
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Joined: May 4th, 2007,
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Getting back to Mitose (although I never really care if threads evolve organically into other areas) I asked Ron Chapel about his meetings with Mitose when Mitose came to talk with Ed Parker. He told me that Mitose spoke very good English and had less of an accent than Ed Parker did. So it looks like the idea that Mitose didn't speak or understand English well enough to get a fair trial was just another con.
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RE: Mitose: the man, the myth - May 15th, 2007, 12:13:06 PM
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GAB
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HI Dan, About John Leoning:
I am not sure he called it specificly "Shotokan" but he did say the name, used much of the hitting of the makawara and the stances, I remember him saying much of the art came from there. Which it did. Early katas in Kajukenbo used the terms that were given to the katas.
At that time he was studing with Share K. Lew, later Share K. Lew was teaching out of his Dojo. He was involved with the movie Kung Fu. (Share K. Lew was referred to as his master and was a monk) much of it came from them (movie) IMHO...
He was on a path that did not need Kajukenbo, they needed him. Bill Ryusaki was in the movies also. It was a two way street for them I believe. Bill got a black belt from Leoning and moved on to the Van Nuys area, his own school and others in the movie industry. I believe Gene Le Bell was in the same stunt org. "Stunts unlimited", something that gathered these guys also.
Kung Fu was offered and weapons. John Leoning was a ground breaker and was not under the thumb of anyone, I figure. He was 5th in Kaju but higher under SKL, I believe.
He may well have been one of the highest ranked, at the time of his death. He certainly had good credentials. His white and red belt is higher than a 5th I am thinking.
Why are they (Kaju) trying to make others seem like they had no credential's when in fact the credentals are very scarce unless they go to Mitose IMHO. Other wise it is bogus. No Shaolin from Hoon, nothing legit. The story of 5 with out credentals making up an art form. It is a good one but it is not legit if you are looking for credentals. IMHO...Even though some are suspect, at least they did study with Mitose.
They are caught in their own web of intrigue. No Mitose, no lineage I believe.
In Police work we are always talking about the roots, and if they are tainted so is the fruit of the search (evidence).
So, you have not mentioned when the time period of the patch of JL??
Gary
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RE: Mitose: the man, the myth - May 15th, 2007, 12:24:16 PM
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GAB
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Joined: May 9th, 2007,
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Danjo
Getting back to Mitose (although I never really care if threads evolve organically into other areas) I asked Ron Chapel about his meetings with Mitose when Mitose came to talk with Ed Parker. He told me that Mitose spoke very good English and had less of an accent than Ed Parker did. So it looks like the idea that Mitose didn't speak or understand English well enough to get a fair trial was just another con.
I am not so sure I'd agree with you on that, from the people that I have talked to that were in the prison have mentioned he did speak well. And in the transcript, (court) went to a lot of trouble to make sure he had someone to make sure he got his day in court.
If they felt he needed it he did IMHO...
Here is something I believe is important to your hair idea in the hand of the dead man.
Terry Lee's wife was there and she was an indian from a reservation in South Dakota (asian hair, indian's of America, share the gene pool of the asian). She was a prime suspect in my way of thinking, very poor investigation by Inv. Ferrand.
Kempo and Kosho were both in the transcript. Much earlier than Bruce Juchnik's meeting with the man.
Gary
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